When you sign a petition you are saying you support what the petition is about. Some signers obviously don’t, so I don’t understand why they would put their signature on it.
Some of the comments are as follows:
So much for your on line petition. All positive comments eh?
That’s because you choose to remove any comments you deem anti flash. Put my previous comment back up. Show some guts.
Btw sent from my iPhone – one of 30 million sold worldwide. So far you have 336 signatures. Doesn’t compute does it lol
Have you seen how Flash 10.1 is different than what you have used before? Check out somethings from the open screen project at http://www.openscreenproject.com not everything built with flash sucks. I have been on teams that have developed business applications with it as well as games that give an experience different than anything else on the web. Please check out http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashplayer/articles/mobile_demos_fp10.1.html to see everything flash is already running on.
Others have written:
There will never be Flash on the iPad or iPhone.
Thank goodness.
Flash would destroy the app store ecosystem, which would ultimately be bad for developers (can’t make money selling apps), bad for consumers (if developers can’t make money, they stop making great apps), and bad for the platform (apps become junk made by 14 year olds and spammers, constantly crashing your device).
Apple made the right call, for the right reasons. I’m a Flash designer/developer, and I don’t regret for one second Apple’s decision.
I have worked as a Flash designer and developer and I made lots of money doing so. There is a very large community of professional flash and flex developers that make excellent livings building amazing applications. With Air Adobe has created a platform that lets you role your own web apps then charge for them. You must have missed http://www.adobe.com/flashplatform/services/ the Apple App store is not the only game in town to make money from. Since flash is a more mature platform than the iPhone it doesn’t take much to know that developers have made more money building flash applications and products over the past years than all the developers that have been building iPhone apps. With Flash you can achieve the build once, run anywhere dream that developers have had since the second computer operating system was built.
Why do you not even want the option to turn it off? Do you like companies telling you what you can and can’t run on the hardware you own? I personally think I should be in control of what goes on my hardware rather than the manufacture. If you drive a car and want to ad a different set of tires to it, do you have to ask permission from Toyota or GM? Why should you not be able to make your own choices?
I remove the negative signatures as they do not support the petition and are basically just spam. I will allow through some of the negative comments on the postings that make well reasoned arguments. Saying “HTML 5, Javascript and CSS 3 rule and Flash is dead LOL” is not going to be posted because it adds nothing to the discussion.
HTML5 is years away in standardization and support. Microsoft Internet Explorer 6, 7, 8 and most likely 9 will not support it, and unfortunately this is what over 60% of the web and almost all of the corporations use. As developers we all hate Internet Explorer but Flash is the only way around it to build the rich experiences the web has to offer. Why would you want to have to develop your project in HTML5 for Safari and Chrome which have combined less than 10% of the market and then in Flash to support all of the rest of the browsers? I’m a developer, and I hate doing double work to support IE and the others in their different interpretations of CSS2 why would I expect CSS3, HTML5 and each browsers implementation of Javascript to be the same? HTML5 just sounds like a ton more work in the future rather than what can be done with flash today.
I hope HTML5 succeeds, I really do, and guess who will make the tools to build for it? Adobe. Adobe is a tools company, the flash player is just a means to an end, the more flash content is out there that can be used to day the more tools they will sell to build it. Do you not think that if HTML5 becomes available in a big way Adobe wouldn’t support it in its tooling? HTML5 and Flash are not the same, if you think this you really do not know all of what flash can do.
The site has been live for less than 24 hours and only has been promoted by about 30 tweets, 300+ signatures in a few hours is nothing to be upset about. I am sure over the next few days their will be more.
I like my iPhone and I may get a iPad, but I have moved to palms webOS platform so that I can develop for the phone I use the most. Palms hardware is much more user controlable than any of apples mobile hardware at the moment and by the end of February it will be running flash. If Adobe can get flash running well without hurtting the battery life on the Pre which is almost the same hardware as the iPhone 3GS then the road block is Apple. All of these companies have joined the openscreen project to bring flash to their devices, only one big player is missing. http://www.openscreenproject.org/partners/current_partners.html If Google, RIM, and Palm are all going to have flash on their products soon why shouldn’t Apple give us the choice?
If you don’t believe in what the petiton is for, don’t sign it. I care about intent more than numbers.
I AM NOT AN ADOBE EMPLOYEE AND THESE THOUGHTS ARE MY OWN.
Luke Kilpatrick
iWantFlash.com
January 30th, 2010 10:59 am
I don’t think you understood my point. If Flash exists, at all, on the iPhone/iPad, there will be no more iPhone/iPad.
1. if you can use Flash apps from the web, everyone will use free Flash apps from the web, many stolen or decompiled from other apps
2. this means developers will not be able to make money selling apps, so they won’t spend time building them. The only apps left will be poorly built by hobbyists or filled with spam.
3. that means the iPhone/iPad, now filled with junk apps that crash and don’t work well, becomes a worthless device no one wants.
It’s very simple, really. You can have a successful iPhone and iPad without Flash, or you can have nothing. You don’t get another option.
January 30th, 2010 11:13 am
Flash has existed on the web for over 15 years, many many developers make a damn good living building flash applications and charging for them. I know of flex gigs that pay over $150 an hour or more.
The iPhone can use plenty of free JS apps from the web now, why would having access to free flash apps be different?
Developers make plenty of money selling Air Apps, SAP makes boat loads of money building many of their UIs in Flash why would this change?
The iPhone is already filled with tons of junk apps. How many fart machines do you use? Flash apps are already available in the App Store http://labs.adobe.com/technologies/flashcs5/appsfor_iphone/ why would having flash in the browser be different?
Flash already exists in some form on the iPhone, I just want it to exist in its full form rather than complete apple lock down. Do you like writing your code over and over again for different platforms? Or do you only develop for the iPhone/iPad and let Apple determine if you make money or not. I like being in control of my own destiny and saving time.
Developers were making money and developing applications before the Apple Appstore opened and they will be developing and making money after it closes. Apple is not the only platform.
January 30th, 2010 11:30 am
How many developers sell their Flash apps directly to consumers?
Exactly.
I know how much you can make deving Flash, I do it. And I make a lot of money doing it. But you make that money by building apps for corporate clients, and in the end they own the app, and they make the real money.
The app store makes it possible for any developer to sell directly to consumers, which is a far vaster market. And it leaves you the owner of your work. For that to happen, the distribution must be controlled and constrained. Apple is the only platform where that is currently viable.
Average consumers are not web nerds. They don’t want a million options. They want a product that is simple and always works. That comes with constraints. If you hate those constraints, that’s fine, you can choose not to sell to the mainstream. But insisting that the iPhone and iPad should be destroyed just because you don’t like the rules they come with is juvenile.
January 30th, 2010 11:45 am
I don’t want the iPad or iPhone Destroyed at all. I love my iPhone, its a great product, I just want to be able to have the same experience on it that I can have on a desktop, that means having flash.
I have been on 2 Air Projects that used flash and marketed directly to consumers. The ecosystem is growing and people are starting to use it. Most Twitter Apps are built on Air.
There is a ton of other app stores out there, Palm’s App Catalog, Google’s Android Marketplace are all viable options.
There are many paths to making $$ you also might find that many many iPhone apps are being built and paid for by large corps.
I am not anti-apple. I use a MacBook Pro and fought my PC heavy workplace to get it. I just want the full experience of the web.
January 30th, 2010 6:12 pm
@iwantflash: I disagree. Adding Flash to the Apple mobile deice family *will* adversely affect the experience and quality of the device. It’s just not as controllable by the system as, lets say, making a native application.
Also Flash is living out its days. It is good for animation in High School, learning programming a basic level and interacting with multimedia. But now we have these new spec’s coming up like HTML 5 as well as new video distribution methods (HTTP streaming) which are far superior to Flash.
I dont think you should have the same experience as your desktop, because it *isn’t* a desktop… its a mobile device. With a screen thats x10 smaller than a desktop one Flash just doesn’t work.
January 30th, 2010 6:24 pm
Flash has been on Mobile Devices in Japan for years and years, it has not hurt them.
If you believe flash is only for animation and basic programing then you have not used it since Actionscript 3.
Flash is a robust platform for providing content that would be difficult to do with the standards that are out there. Adobe tried to make Actionscript 3 into the ECMAscript standard, but Microsoft killed it. Do a bit of research before a knee jerk reaction that flash on mobile will be all bad. Check out what the flash player is doing with the openscreen project and how flash 10.1 is going to be using the gpu and will be better on memory. http://www.niallharry.com/2009/11/hd-youtube-and-adobe-flash-10-1/
See how flash runs on a whole collection of mobile phones.
http://blog.everythingflex.com/2010/01/08/flash-10-1-coming-to-pre-driod-nexus-one-iphone/
Why would you not want the same experience on you iPhone? Why should your iPhone be an inferior device?
January 30th, 2010 6:56 pm
@iwantflash: Sure it hasnt hurt them. However I think you should have a read of this post http://dontwantflash.com/post/362286058/flash-on-mobile-devices-privacy-disaster-waiting-to
Sure it’s no issue now. What if en exploit was found in Flash and then the 42.48 million devices we trust with our most personal information were vulnerable? Im sure any Identity Thief would jump at the chance to be apart of that.
Just to let you know, I do develop Flash applications. I have used Actionscript 3, and actually quite enjoyed it. But I can see that Flash is this extra layer, a layer we dont need because there are better and more effective methods for doing the same thing.
So far your main need for Flash is only indicated as being video playback. The video playback space in 2010 will change and im hoping it will be HTML 5 along with open technologies like HTTP streaming with adaptive bitrate changing. Meaning any device can choose their own player that is optimised for its system and play it with any chrome or interface that fits the device.
January 30th, 2010 10:38 pm
Could I be so bold to ask, could people visiting this page answer a simple poll? Cheers.
If you want Flash on mobile devices, what is your main reason to use it?
http://answers.polldaddy.com/poll/2622923/
January 31st, 2010 12:02 am
Mac’s stellar computer will eventually evolve after the pumped up period during it’s unveiling. The A4 chip and Apple’s potential to fix hardware will begin to make the iTablet a monster in the time ahead.
January 31st, 2010 5:18 am
Many people make a living out of Cobol and Java, and that does not mean that these technologies should go the way of the trash bin too. Making a living out of a technology doesn’t justify anything. Evolve and learn something new.
January 31st, 2010 11:00 am
Thats just it, Flash is evolving its an active product and it looks like the only place you will not be able to have a flash experience is on an Apple iPad or iPhone. If Flash was end of life like Cobol then I could see your argument maybe having some merit. However Flash will be on more things than ever by the end of 2010, the only people not developing flash will be Apple fan boys. Its the best way to get something cross device and cross platform. Why do you want to rewrite your app in 4 different languages to support all of the platforms.
April 23rd, 2010 9:33 am
I don’t want the iPad or iPhone Destroyed at all. I love my iPhone, its a great product, I just want to be able to have the same experience on it that I can have on a desktop, that means having flash.
I have been on 2 Air Projects that used flash and marketed directly to consumers. The ecosystem is growing and people are starting to use it. Most Twitter Apps are built on Air.
There is a ton of other app stores out there, Palm’s App Catalog, Google’s Android Marketplace are all viable options.
There are many paths to making $$ you also might find that many many iPhone apps are being built and paid for by large corps.
I am not anti-apple. I use a MacBook Pro and fought my PC heavy workplace to get it. I just want the full experience of the web.